::                                                              ::
  ::                     - WHAT'S RATTLIN' ? -                    ::
  ::       The Weekly Digest for Canterbury Music Addicts         ::
  ::                         Issue # 114                          ::
  ::                  Friday, December 18th, 1998                 ::
  ::                                                              ::


From: CuneiWay@aol.com
Subject: Oh, my, no....
Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 16:15:57 EST

Hello all,

I was pretty appalled to see my posting about our reissue of Delivery listed
right below Aymeric's announcement of Steve Miller's death.

This posting was sent into WR well before I knew of Steve's death, & in NO WAY
was I trying to "capitalize" on Steve's death.

Hopefully everyone could have figured that out for themselves, but I wanted to
clarify things so that I can sleep with a clean conscience tonite....

Steve F.


From: neato@pipeline.com
Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 20:27:08 -0500 (EST)

What a shame that the good news of the CD release of the very rare Delivery LP "Fools Meeting" is overshadowed by the passing of Steve Miller... hopefully the fine Coxhill Miller/ Miller Coxhill recording on Virgin's Caroline label will see light of day soon as well

Remember too that Miller joined up with Caravan on "Waterloo Lilly"

                                all my mistakes were once acts of genius


From: mihra@cerbernet.co.uk (Roger Bunn)
Subject: Battered Ornaments etc.
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 02:09:53 +0000

[Julian wrote:]
>At this time both John Marshall and Chris Spedding were also playing
>with Jack Bruce

That's right. It was a strange sorta of mix. The ambitiously and elegent Spedding who could read fly shit from when he first left school and through when we both met on Archer St. Before it was closed down by the Brit government for
musicians being in the way and "loitering with intent". The intent was finding freelance work.

Here was where i first met chris. outside the Red Lion where Monday after Monday though the 40s,50s, and 60s when freelancers such as he and I would meet and exchange views jokes, gigs pints, and occasionally, even ideals.

There were some v v strange characters around. Bobby Swartze, who posed as a drummer, could gig every night and pretended not to be a villain. <g>. But Everyone went to ARCHER STREET until the Brit government closed it DOWN. Then and only then, the cartel took control over the independent music print media.

The Melody Maker? The New Musical Exoress?
Etc etc etc etc and even the BBC..


Then free lance work went rapidly down hill. And if you were not "in the studios reading fly shit" or "part of the cartel "artisitc set".  If your face "didn't fit" you were "on your own". Great for some, but not for the family huh?

For me all that soon changed when I went to Holland to work on my solo album and  came back, after a marketing #fiasco, and got together Piblokto with Pete.

"Gerra proper job" Sha la la la ..Gerra Job?

>check out the "Harmony Row" album, one of Jack's finest and the
>Spedding/Brown track (yes that is Pete Brown, the lyricist for Cream and
>Bruces longtime partner)

Look I do not have "a down" on everyone. But in a few  worthwhile cases, Ginger, Spedding and a few, a v few other guys. Whether reading fly shit or not, I know a poser when i see one.  And I remember what he said about Jimi.

Cop for this

>Leaving in the Spring of 1972 to play sessions (notably for Chris


>:-) Can you elaborate?

Clever READING guitarist, he is in the auto already talking about the "limitations of Hendrix". Swelled headed reading gizmo man, with the right connections for getting lots of big band dance work. v good friend of Micky Most, see biog? Revently Hoteye (sp?), Japan's number 1 guitarist used him on an album.

They both are assholes. But I like Hoteye the better. ;_)

>Is it true that the Battered Ornaments threw Pete out?

George Khan was behind that, him and Chris the asshole wanted Brown to spend lotsa Cream bread on them, and he didn't trust'em, and neither would I, so they threw him out. He has not got the best voice in the world.

>Twisted Track originally shows up on the Batterred Ornaments album
>"Mantlepiece".  BO were Pete Brown's backing band for a while and their
>version has Spedding singing Brown Lyrics.

Oh fk !! was that a let down!! Remember how "thin" the guitar sounded? It was far too "manufactured" to be seriously related to where we and progressive rock was all going. and that was where sich as Wyatt was in his political life was also going, towards  black music, black jazz, far from Canterbury and far from any such reasoning. And the few that took the plunge were but the leaders in thought.

>I believe the Pete Brown Albums, originally on Harvest, were released
>on Repertoire a few years ago

Oh really? Wish he'd told me.;-)

That EMI Publishing is it?
B'stards never even talk to me.

(never mind, when in trouble, Pete has a nack of stepping in. He should have been a / my banker. Luv'im and his poetry.)
What a system!!  Jeez and two sheeshes.! argh!!!

>Also Chris Spedding did some Top Gear sessions in 1971(?) which featured
>Roy Babbington on Bass

Should I better call him?

>and John Marshall on Drums.  

"Neat" Said Madonna

>And Chris' first solo album "Songs without words" is" an excellent early
>70's Jazz/Rock album which is worth listening too.

Let's disagree on that shall we? It was far too cold, when what was being sought was warmth. And in fact maybe this album is really a reflection of the session musician mentality of the time, (it was Chris's band) during when one Never saw a non white musician in the London studios.

>It was a Harvest release originally and too my knowledge has not been
>re-released on CD.

"Originally", they (EMI Harvest) split the contract and as they had signed both Pete and the Battereds (already signed because Pete had his Big connection with Jack and the Cream.) When the Battereds split they had to recope their investment. So Pete went with Bron Management and "the boyz" went back into the studio as they were contracted so to do.

As Bron also did Pete's publishing, and as I haven't seen any royalties in decades, no wonder he is my personal banker huh?

Thanks,  but Julian you bring back scores of these memories  {Argh!!!] ;-) Most worthwihle. (Please send more pain killers.)



From: "David Voci" <david_voci@tcibr.com>
Subject: Whats Rattlin' for Christmas? Not 'One Way', that's for sure.
Date: 09 Dec 98 15:40:15 -0800

Too bad about One Way dropping the Soft Machine titles as these were very inexpensive and sound quality was fine...Also, they were the only domestic outlet to even get these recordings as Columbia/Sony never reissued these on their own label in the U.S. except for Third. The artwork was pretty much duplicated exact (in most cases) so no limitation there (Hawkwind, on this label, is another story however).

I remember looking for Soft Machine CD's in the early 90's before One Way reissued them and noticed that Italy has most of the numeric titles available on CBS/Italy or England???

I can't well imagine that these CD's will sit too long without some company like See For Miles/Repertoire/BGO/Cuneiform or similar pick them up... We will see...

After a couple of listens to Egg and Polite Force I was immediately reminded of the curious and very likable 'Crazy World of Arthur Brown' record... Not all songs mind you but enough that it made sense to comment here... same era and musical similarity to the scene at the time etc, a period when guitar and keys were fighting for the same limelight with maybe keys winning the battle(Atomic Rooster is an immediate similar listen). Arthur Brown is a deep/dark/thought provoking person and his voice is equal to that description I'm sure. I have seen him mentioned on these pages before so here it is again.

Last but not least a thanks to Age Rosthuizen for reminding me about New Sonic Architecture(www.SONARC.NET/nsaframe.html) for having Soft Heap's first and Gilgamesh's second... Bought a variety of things and our friend Matt M. does  run a very nice business.
Best Of Times,dv


From: neato@pipeline.com
Subject: Nucleus CD releases
Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 20:15:42 -0500 (EST)

[Julian Christou <christou@as.arizona.edu> wrote:]
>"Twisted Track originally shows up on the Batterred Ornaments album
>"Mantlpiece".  BO were Pete Brown's backing band for a while and their
>version has Spedding singing Brown Lyrics.  BTW the BO also featured Rab
>Spall  (who has plyed with Ayers & Wyatt) and also Goerge Khan.  An
>excellent band - I wonder if that will ever see the light of day on CD.

Battered Ornaments - "Mantle Piece" - came out with 2 bonus trax on Repertoire... Their second, "A meal u can shake hands with in the dark" as well

>I believe the Pete Brown Albums, originally on Harvest, were released
>on Repertoire a few years ago

That would be Pete Brown and Piblokto... both records CD released on Repertoire as well

>Also Chris Spedding did some Top Gear sessions in 1971(?) which featured
>Roy Babbington on Bass and John Marshall on Drums. And Chris' first solo
>album "Songs without words" is an excellent early 70's Jazz/Rock album which
>is worth listening too. It was a Harvest release originally and to my
>knowledge has not been re-released on CD.

Both Spedding's records for Harvest, "Backwards Progression" and "Only Lick I
Know" have been released on CD by (u guessed it!) Repertoire

Repertoire does have a website with their entire catalog..


                                all my mistakes were once acts of genius


From: Koro Ito <479153@pnet.energia.co.jp>
Subject: The Digital Bootleg Question - Musicians points
Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 14:22:29 +0900

Subject: The Digital Bootleg Question - Musicians points
        (Some additional words on The Digital Bootleg agenda with my friend
         named MARK H.)
From: Koro Ito (479153@pnet.energia.co.jp)

Hallo again, Aymeric and all the readers.

Here are some additional words on the agenda I interacted with my friend/active musician named MARK H. My point of view on this difficult problem is that I must be more ethical as a listener/collector on our creative Canterbury music. Our endless enthusiasm not only decrease musicians' creativity but also prevent good small labels like my dear Hazel's OGUN from being active, to be unable to issue NEW sounds or reissue many good old LPs on CD-format (not on CD-R).

(Months ago, my old friend John Jack of Cadillac wrote to me that his latest issue by Stan Tracey was highly recommended and well recieved by the market, so using those profits he could plan to reissue some LPs from his out of print catalogue. This is a true circulation, isn't it?)

Readers, please read...


>I think the discussions on the copyright and old-vs.-new are important but
>difficult problems not to get the good-for-all conclusion. But it is true
>that many enthu-collectors tend to step over the marginal line into kinds
>of criminal fields. I regret such a tragic paradox.

So do we - the Musicians -. I'm glad you have brought that up. It is a new problem and we need  to keep everyone reminded that we (and our children) have to eat.
What is wrong with audio cassette anyway? Why do 'fans' HAVE to have old recordings on CD-R? Its much easier to copy a cassette tape. Musicians SELL Music & CD's to survive. It's all they have.

>And we must respect the present sounds/artists more than the past.
>Future masterpieces may be born this moment....

Of course, Musically its a very prolific moment in time, but who's to say how long it will last? Remember the 1980's? There is GREAT new Music to listen to being composed now, witness Phil Miller's records. Pip's 7 year itch  etc.etc. Doesn't being a 'fan' of the Music mean a little concern for the Artist? It's a shame so few fans are buying any of the new stuff.....

It's causing an extremely limiting situation for Musicians/Bands.

I will be able to keep recording and playing because of my other interests. (ie. Touring/Sonnet, my ISP company/other Music than Canterbury etc.). But I hate to think what will become of other Canterbury Musicians as money slowly dries up because of digital bootlegging, swapping old recordings, falling numbers at Concerts and less gigs organised. Rather than bootleg old stuff, why don't these fans put on gigs? Then as the promoter Musicians would be pleased to GIVE them a recording.

>Well, I am very much interested in your MASHBOKETH CD-R project at THIS moment.
>But why? Let me know.
>(Is this the first issue of that HERITAGE series noticed on FACELIFT's ad?)

Its fantastic Music. No, its not part of any series. It appears like this to stir up arguments about digital bootlegging. Is this how the fans want it? Because I WILL do 'one-offs' with all my unreleased archives. Or not put them out at all.... No threat is intended, just protectionism for Musicians; and their families, (who are still entitled to royalties for 75 years after the Artists death. - Copyright LAW)

Which is why I have said I will only answer questions about it in 'WR' newsletter. I do not seriously want to sell Music in 'one-off' CD-R form, like this.
(at only 3300 UKP, for the MASHBOKETH 'one-off' CD-R. Thats much too cheap
- how much do TV sets & HiFi's cost now? Or computer software?)

To seriously sell 'one-off' CD-R's for collectors we will need to be charging at least 35,000 to 310,000 UKP each. This puts the Music in the same 'arts retail' field as lower priced 'fine art' paintings. I know I can find dealers who would be very pleased to create a new arts 'investment' market niche. An auction system would be a 'worst case' scenario.

To start selling Music like this is a kind of crime in itself; but it would enable us to survive doing maybe 5 CD-R's a year. (perhaps with Musicians like Elton, Pip, Richard, Hugh, Daevid etc. Whoever I could put together here at MUSART.)

For fans, the problem is that none of them; (unless they are prepared to pay for the 'one-off' CD-R's), will ever hear any of the Music we produce, as people who collect Art for *investment*; and thats what we're talking about for 'one-off' CD-R's; will not be interested in what is actually on the record. Just that there's only ONE of it: Hence REAL rarity, and a real MARKET.

The poor fans of the Canterbury Musicians will wonder forever if they missed something. Listeners in fact, will lose; because the quality of sounds we now record; even on re-masters, are far in advance of any old bootleg. New CD's cost 'a few quid' to buy, that's all.

With the 'one-off' CD-R technique, there's another advantage for us as Musicians too. We can TOTALLY cut out all the 'middle-men' in shady so-called 'record companies' & the much worse 'distributors'.

Always with these kind of people there are problems about dividing and paying money to Musicians. Richard Branson seems to have started this idea to make easy cash from a soft 'target'. There are exceptions to this rule, of course, but they are very very rare. Musicians, in the future will be paid before the secretary or cleaner.

I know I will be hated in some areas by a few people for these ideas, but my concern is with Musicians; who have no old age pension scheme. (Because they can't afford it). They are the people who actually imagine, compose and produce the Music. Not 'shoplift' it, (Elton's term).

>And how about the night with Richard S.? Does he keep his CANTERBURY voice?

Oh sure, it was a nice night, he will be back to record here at MUSART soon, I think. He's bought a new Gibson Guitar (ES 125D) and he's off travelling round in Europe for a while; seems to be enjoying himself a lot! Playing well; and 'gargling' well too!


At the end of this long conversation, I must record that Mark shows his musicians point across to the agenda at the risk of losing his popularity in this good musical circle...

Everybody, please listen to the new music for the welcoming new century!

                                              From Hiroshima with peace,
                                                        KORO ITO


From: "David Voci" <david_voci@tcibr.com>
Subject: Elton Dean/Just Us And...
Date: 16 Dec 98 13:44:01 -0800

Hullo Rattlers,
Just got Just Us/Elton Dean on Cuneiform and extremely satisfied about this beautiful recording...Especially the extra 3 tracks at the end...Nothing like long, extended CB workouts to satisfy the soul(Bishopsgate)...Is the unmentioned track(#8) at the end a surprise from Steve F or simply an oversight?

Recently acquired Soft Heap-ST, Keith Tippett's 'Dedicated' and Piblokto's 'Art School' among others and just wanted to say thanks to What's Rattlin and all of you who contribute as alot of this music would have been otherwise ignored...A definite treasure chest of rewarding music and oops , forgot to mention/commend Hugh Hopper and guests for a great recording in 'Monster Band'...this is some great stuff on this disc with the live material really kicking ass...I am not so irritated now, after hearing the studio version of 'Sliding Dogs', that this was omitted from the See For Miles Isotope release.
Love the ambiental/experimental feel of 'Churchy' on this disc as well.




While working on his profile for Calyx, I was recently in contact with Jakko Jakszyk, he of Rapid Eye Movement, Stewart-Gaskin, The Lodge, Pip Pyle / 7 Year Itch etc. fame (not to mention Level 42!). Here are a few newsbits direct from the man himself. Any questions will be forwarded to him, so don't hesitate!

- Rapid Eye Movement did record some stuff in the studio. There are also a number of reasonably good live tapes and I have recently talked to Dave about releasing something. [how's that for unexpected news?!? - AL]

- The Album that I made for Chiswick records 'Silesia' is to be released by them on CD in the new year. As well as the original tracks it also features singles and 'b' sidess from that same period. Dave [Stewart] produces three of the tracks and plays on a few others. His solo on 'Ingmar Bergman on the window sill' is a real corker. Other guests include Amanda Parsons on Multi tracked backing vocals (very Hatfields) and Dave Jackson (Van Der Graff) plays sax on virtualy every track.

- I am currently working on the follow up to 'The Road to Ballina'. BBC Radio 3
have comisioned me to compose a piece using the same technique. This one is
tentativly entitled 'The Mysterious Death of Mario Lanza' and I fly to LA next
Month to interview his freinds and relatives. I also plan to put out a new
solo record next year and will record, amongst my own new compositions, a
great song of Mark Kings that he didn't put on his new album. As for what I
have been doing. Well I compose for TV/film etc. This keeps me busy and fed. I
don't think naming the job's is such a good idea as very few have a distinct
Jakko stamp (whatever that may be) As ever there are all sorts of projects
muted which may or may not come to fruition. Currently boiling away are a
book/film about the real story behind the 'Balina' saga. A collaborative album
with Richard Barbieri. Maybe an instrumental/guitar based record and numerous
speech related radio/TV idea's.

- At this very moment in time I've just bought a new house and am having a new
studio built in the back garden. I have just got married and (this might
interest/amuse you) she is the beautiful daughter of Mike Giles (The original
drummer in King Crimson). He is currently at Real World recording a solo album
on which I shall be playing (keep it in the family).


From: Milos Latislav <milos@muzikus.cz>
Subject: Re: WR 110/111 - bootlegging?
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1998 10:59:59 +0100

Hello Aymeric and all Ratllers,

I wasn't imagine to start this big discussion about so-called digital bootlegging and related problems via my letter or 'advertise'. Mark's and Elton's words were strong and frustrating for me. I'm really not a bootlegger or shoplifter, I guess. My minor knowledge of English was the source of my silence for some time. But now I see, all wrong is good for something, like we in Czech says. There are some new discoveries. I'm not only one ED big fan. Many thanks for all your opinions and support, especially Ely, Aymeric and Chris C. (I'm awaiting for Wyatt video via Czech ReR distributors). I think our good discussion forum getting better and better.

And now something other. I've recently heard ULTRAMARINE album "United Kingdoms" from 1993 with guest vocal performance from Robert Wyatt on some tracks. There is also major contribution from Jimmy Hastings on flute, clarinet and soprano sax. Music is very intelligent pop with strong Wyatt and Softs/Hatfield influences, I think this is better than Stewart/Gaskin albums, which are in the same style area.

Recently I've purchased some new Elton Dean's albums, including Newsense, Three's A Company... and Into The Nierika. They are all absolutely great, especially Newsense. Some reviews will follows.

Best regards


Conducted by e-mail / December 18, 1998

Q: What main differences were there, in your opinion, for PMG between the stage and the studio?
A: There are differences. On stage, you have interaction between the band and the audience. As you know, the intensity varies, from polite interest - hopefully - to collective hystery, as my parents used to say. In the studio it's hard to create a positive atmosphere, but the good side is the better technical conditions, the possibility of multiple takes, guest musiciens... The musical concept of PMG, however, was largely the same on stage and in the studio - two keyboard-percussionists (vibraphone, xylo-marimba) accompanied by the guitar / bass / drums trio.

Q: "Second Wind" was quite a democratic album compared to the previous ones. Was there more of a "band feeling" in PMG at the time?
A: "SW" was a bit like "Expresso II" for me - I hadn't written anything on that album except "Heavy Tune" which I composed on a bass guitar. Luckily I was alone at home that day!... I did however write some stuff, like "Deep End", the title of which actually refers to a swimming pool; "Exotic", which is better in the version that's on "Full Circle"; and "Beton", which was not very good; and of course the title track. As to whether it was more a band than before, well... The split was mostly to do with the lack of gigs and record contracts. However the guys in the band didn't show as much faith in the band as ten years before. They wanted to move on to other things.

Q: How did you discover these tapes? Do you have more in your archives?
A: Well, I found the tape by chance, in my cellar. Other tapes? Nothing good enough for release, I don't think.

Q: Why isn't Frank Fischer, the keyboard player on "Second Wind", on "Full Circle"? Who plays the synth parts?
A: He was fired from the band early in the tour. He didn't fit from a rhythmic point of view. I had to send him back home after a majority vote. The synth parts were played by Benoit, who played on a Kat vibraphone, et Stefan who had an acoustic Musser but also Midi-fied.

Q: In 1997, after almost ten years out of the public eye, you joined Brand X, then Gong. Why did you decide to "come back"?
A: I spent these ten years playing in various American musicals, as I needed money after the "Breakthrough" fiasco. Then I met Brand X's manager, Shawn Ahearn (of Pangea Music), through a mutual friend who lived in Kansas, while playing "Evita" there. After so much time playing in the pit, I wanted to go back on center stage.

Q: What are you plans for the near future? Still planning to form a percussion ensemble?
A: No, not at the moment. It's more of a long term project, I'm afraid. I haven't had the opportunity to make any progress with that. Right now I'm back home in Alsace, writing new music. I've just been fired from "West Side Story" after a row with the conductor. Next Spring, "classic Gong" will hit the road again, but with Pip Pyle on drums again as I wasn't going to be able to do it... "A la revoyure", as we say here, "see you soon" !


                            END OF ISSUE 114


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