::                                                              ::
  ::                     - WHAT'S RATTLIN' ? -                    ::
  ::       The Weekly Digest for Canterbury Music Addicts         ::
  ::                         Issue # 113                          ::
  ::                 TO THE MEMORY OF STEVE MILLER                ::
  ::                   Friday, December 4th, 1998                 ::
  ::                                                              ::


From: Mark HEWINS <hewins@musart.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 09 Dec 1998 12:14:22 +0000

Hello everyone,
Phil just rang me and has asked to relay the very sad news of Steve's death
this morning. He leaves a wife (Minna) and Daughter (Stephanie)
I will write more, later; but for the moment; any donations and messages of
support for the family can be addressed via Phil at:

29a Colvestone Crescent,
London E8 2LG



From: CuneiWay@aol.com
Subject: future release news
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 17:30:02 EST

Of interest to Canterbury fans are two releases that are confirmed and are
currently scheduled for release sometime in May, 1999:

Hughscore - Delta Flora
[Hugh Hopper & Caveman Shoestore. This is a goodie]

Delivery - Fool's Meeting
[Led by pianist Steve Miller, this was also the first professional band of Phil Miller, Pip Pyle, Roy Babbington & Carol Grimes. Released in 1970, this is long out of print. Mike King is supervising this project, & has co-ordinated the conducting of interviews with Steve Miller & has gotten access to some great unseen photos, Steve's diaries & more. Mike will be writing the booklet [as he did for us on Gary Windo's "His Master's Bones"] The sound has been drastically remastered in the studio by Mike, & it sounds fantastic compared to the very thin sound that the lp had. Will also include several bonus tracks]

More as there is more to report.

Steve F.


From: mihra@cerbernet.co.uk (Roger Bunn)
Subject: bootlegging
Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 02:34:16 +0000

In reply to the reply about Internet bootlegging, brought up by Chris Cutler,  is another area of concern here. Sure, the internet is free.  But talent is not. It takes a lot of work to put together an album, a song even, and the enjoyment
we get from it deserves our official recognition in return.

"Official" being the key word. If one substituted the word "centralized" then some light may begin to show at the end of the almost total chaos of the cyber pirate tunnel. And there are already expensive engines that can trace illegal copies. It's just that such as the RIAA and the MCPS "official" anti-piracy departments have No Interest in these smaller cases. If you want to know why, then I can tell you. but it's not for general publication, here and right now.

And whether such august bodies actually "work in the public interest" any longer is also "up for debate" if not for "grabs".

But the "outlook" looks indeed v grave for such small bodies as loosely represented on the web by such as this list to which some people, loyal people and researchers contribute.

Actually it also takes "a lot of work" to put together a life, whether one comes from, or goes to  Canterbury or not. But not many people know that..


From: neato@pipeline.com
Subject: Nucleus/Jenkins
Date: Sat, 5 Dec 1998 11:21:21 -0500 (EST)

[David Voci <david_voci@tcibr.com> wrote:]
>I do own the double CD release of the first two Nucleus records on BGO
>but... it would be hella cool to be able to buy the rest of the catalogue
>on CD

A few (3?) Nucleus records were reissued on cd by the now defunct line
label from Germany... "Elastic rock", "We'll talk about it later" and the
excellent Ian Carr 'solo' "Belladonna"... the latter featuring an early John McLaughlin-inspired Allan Holdsworth, soon-to-be Soft Machine bassist Roy Babbington and Matching Mole keyboardist Dave Macrae - who actually recorded Mole's "Little red record" during the same time as "Belladonna" (summer 72)... Carr of course was a great fan of the electric Miles Davis bands (he wrote a Miles bio) but his sound also quotes players like Freddie Hubbard as well... a
most underrated player definitely an overlooked band and hopefully cd's of their extensive catalog will be forthcoming.

I also recently got the cd reissue(virgin 2007) of the first Gilgamesh record... Hadn't heard it in years but holds up remarkably well... important in that it was a precursor to the first recorded sessions of National Health... in fact both Gowen and Phil Lee are on the early "Health" sessions recorded a few months later... My only complaint being the relatively flat production, not really typical of other records recorded at the Manor in that era


PS-  I too would like to applaud the way the Calyx Canterbury website has
gotten better and better (graphically and information wise) since its
"humble beginnings"... great work A.L. !!

                                all my mistakes were once acts of genius


From: mihra@cerbernet.co.uk (Roger Bunn)
Subject: Laurie Allan
Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 02:36:25 +0000

In reply to ut:
>So Laurie was fired and you played the Lyceum with a new drummer?

Nope. The show, as far as PIBLOKTO was concerned, "fell apart". Most embarrassing... Laurie couldn't keep the times, even though I was on bass and others were counting in the songs. He had "gone". Only his body was flailing softly behind the kit. The spot lights were shining, the 1000s in the audience  was grooving and the band was ready to "do the strut" (whatever that was, at the time) (probably me banging the bass against anything I could find that would make it sound "unusual" when it was needed.) and Lol? He was totalled.

Lol had "been to a wedding" and for those who have almost survived marraige will tell you, "Weddings aren't all they are cracked up to be be doo be to be."



From: "Denis Dujardin" <denis.dujardin@skynet.be>
Subject: About Canterbury...
Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 19:27:40 +0100
While listening to Egg's first, I write this down. The curious and funny text of self-legitimacy on the back sleeve does not resume what can be understood under "Canterbury" (or what is meant in this site), but it reveals, I think, much of the beginning at that time of a specific European scene, which was definitely un-American, whitout having the aim to set this up as a statement as such.
Being Flemish, 40 years old, as a youngster of 16, I was first introduced to the first Soft Machine by a friend. It did change my musical taste fundamentally, in a time where pop/rock music in America and Europe was definitely quite alike. This European scene , later named Canterbury, of which I think this is ridiculously too reducing as a definition, - was browsing in the margins of contemporary music and used their apparent virtuose technique, to make music which was unalike the popular stuff we had through the media at that time. This creative surch in the margins of music still determines my taste up to now.
Unlike my fiends from that time, back at the beginning of the seventies, I do think that since that time there has been quite a bit of interesting music , that was unconciously renewing, redefining or even iconoclastic, especially nowadays.

(Those friends, being Canterbury-fans (still using this stupid definition) are convinced that time stood still, the moment that the Softs finished their "seventh").

To name just two: State 808 in the eighties with "Excell" which had an enormous influence on the contemporary Techno/house/jungle scene.
And this one superb piece, which reveals allready 21th century: Adam F's "Metropolis". Obligatory stuff for those who believe nothing happens nowadays!

Why these two examples? Because i think they issue from creative minds who are musically spoken, extremely skillfull, and they're influence is very much underestimated.

That is why, one could easily make a comparison with this so called Canterbury/European scene.
Henry Cow, Soft Machine, Gilgamesh, National Health, Gong, Matchin Mole, Wyatt's individual (very melancholical) LP's, The Work, Fred Frith, Art Bears, Dave Macrae quartet, Dagmar Krause, Egg, Hatfield (my favourites); unfortunately apart from the two last (but certainly not least) ones, I think I must have seen them all in concert (some of them a few times even, about everywhere in Europe). All of them where very skillfull musicians, but they had this in common, that they did not use their virtuose capacities, to use them as a statement as such, but they applied them, almost modestly, in a subordinated way, to make music which was very much unalike the other contemporary stuff. Their music was incredibly rich and varying, but it never appeared as a statement of virtuosity, allthough it was very virtuose, as well as inventiveness in compository technique, as well as the skillful playing itself concerns. And you could smell the pleasure they had in playing it!

It was of course very "english" and this is very clear when you compare them with the French counterparts (Magma (and their superb "Köntarkösz" and the initial ZAO with Jeff Seffer) and Belgian counterparts (Univers Zero: the most funerary music from that time but intelligent and unique ).
Rock-critics were unable to sort out a refined opinion about them, because they lacked the accurate vocabulary for this sort of music. The frustrated ones amongst them, just ridiculised them, saying that they were only trying to make music as cryptic and difficult as possible, as if those groups were aiming at some sort of intellectualistic elitary attitude.
When now in 1998 I browse through my record collection, I must admit that my preference for those records (-some of them being allmost "transparant", due to the millions of times they were listened too, as f.e. the 1st Hatfield...-) then, my preference is still very much alive for those performers, allthough I have continuously being interested in music during the 80-ties (which were mainly "pose": music had to be "simple" and catchy, a statement which originated in punk, but was warmly wellcomed by capitalism.) and now the 90-ties, which seem to become much more interesting than the former decade (complexity in music fortunately being tolerated again) : listen to those youngsters like J Majik, Boymerang, Photek, Peshay, Doc Scott, Adam F, Leon Mar, Luke Vipert or Amon Tobin and find out that they are very skillfull, very creative and to be compared with those early seventies, mainly English groups.

Technology of course gives them a lot of advantages, but this technology is used, skillfully and in a very creative manner, rather than being considered as a goal on its own.
As far as my specific preference from the early seventies concerns : here they are:

1. The first Hatfield, which is unique in its diversity. Especially "Shaving is boring" which starts in a typical Hatfield-cosiness , ending up into a hallucinating psychedelic last half.

2. The first two Softs and "Moon" on the third. Incomparable in music history.

3. The somewhat spooky "Little Red Record"; Matching mole.

4. "A visit to newport hospital" on Egg's "the polite force". Who can find me the Uriel tracks?

5. "Western culture". Henry Cow's' monument. One of my favourite records all time. Stunningly original. Absolutely superb from start to end.

6. "Brickyard" on "Slow Crimes": The Work. Tim Hodgkinsons' superb compository technique even with minimalistic logistics.

7. "Ruins" on Henry Cow's Unrest.

8. Allthough very sad and melancholic: "Muddy Mouth" Fred Frith on piano and Wyatt (mouth) on "Ruth is stranger........"

9. The civil surface: Egg becomes very mature.......

10. "The Bryden step part two" and "Squarer for Maud" on National Health's "Of Queues and cures"

11. Perhaps not really related to the "Canterburies": This Heat, with its superb drummer Charles Hayward: "Horizontal Hold" an apocalyptic pre-techno piece.

12. Some of the Bruford-albums with Dave Stewart.
Who can find me National Health's "missing pieces"?

From: "J.F. Verreault" <amnesie@total.net>
Subject: Caravan on "Canterburied Sounds"
Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 23:30:54 -0400

Hi Aymeric,

Can you provide me with a bit of info regarding the Caravan tunes on "Canterburied Sounds", namely:

"Feelin', Reelin', Squealin'"  (10:18)
"Summertime"  (7:10)
"As I Feel I Die"  (4:44)
"Where But For Caravan Would I"  (11:59)

First, how's the sound quality? Are any of these performances dated? And, lastly, how's the performance?

I bought the Wilde Flowers CD a while ago, and although I can clearly see its historical value, I haven't listened to it more than a couple of times... So I'm  being extra careful before buying any of the Canterburied Sounds CDs. I would have much prefered a single CD of the Caravan material...


From: "Brigid" <bsb@musicnow.ndirect.co.uk>
Subject: info
Date: Sat, 5 Dec 1998 23:41:23 -0000

Quick note to add a bit more info to the site

Laurie Baker (played with Alan Gowan in Sunship, also with Pip Pyle and
others etc) has a page at :


There is also a bit more info on Peoples Liberation Music on Lauries page -
begun in 72 first gig 73 at Falmouth Art College. Pip Pyle played with the
band on several demo's on the back of a truck as well as straight gigs over
2-3 years.
PLM and Henry Cow also played on the same concert at Battersea  organised by
Music for Socialism, which they were involved in.

Robert Wyatt -  CD Flotsam and Jetsam - bits and pieces of previously
unreleased material on a Rough Trade release.

Best wishes
Brigid on postroom@musicnow.co.uk


From: Julian Christou <christou@as.arizona.edu>
Subject: Nucleus CD releases
Date: Mon, 07 Dec 1998 11:46:39 -0700

I just read David Voci's letter in the latest What's Rattlin'? about Nucleus.

Yes, the first two CD's have been released as a double package on BGO
sounding as great as always.  I agree that These two albums really show
Jenkins' talent as a writer and player as well.  Very prolific but an
excellent bad all aound.  At this time both John Marshall and Chris
Spedding were also playing with Jack Bruce, check out the "Harmony Row"
album, one of Jack's finest and the Spedding/Brown track (yes that is
Pete Brown, the lyrixcist for Cream and Bruces longtime partner)
"Twisted Track originally shows up on the Batterred Ornaments album
"Mantlpiece".  BO were Pete Brown's backing band for a while and their
version has Spedding singing Brown Lyrics.  BTW the BO also featured Rab
Spall  (who has plyed with Ayers & Wyatt) and also Goerge Khan.  An
excellent band - I wonder if that will ever see the light of day on CD.
I bellieve the Pete Brown Albums, originally on Harvest, were released
on Repertoire a few years ago.  Also Chris Spedding did some Top Gear
sessions in 1971(?) which featured Roy Babbington on Bass and John
Marshall on Drums.  And Chris' first solo album "Songs without words" is
an excellent early 70's Jazz/Rock album which is worth listening too.
It was a Harvest release originally and too my knowledge has not been
re-released on CD.

And now for Nucleus: I have heard that  "Out of the Long Dark" and "Old
Heartland" have just been released on a double CD on BGO I think?  I've
also heard that Polygram plans to release all the others on CD in
chronological order!  Line (the now defunkt German label) had released
the last album by the original line-up of Nucleus - "Solar Plexus" which
was written exclusively by Ian Carr and  is still my favourite Nucleus
album.  They also released the follow-up album  "Belladonna" which
featured Roy Babbington on Bass and Allan Holdsworth on Guitar and was
produced by  Jon Hiseman (of Collosseum fame).  unfortunately both of
these are now deleted (as is the complete Line catalogue).

As for the United Jazz + Rock Ensemble.  Their albums are worth picking
up.  Among their intermnational membership are Ian Carr, Jon Hiseman and
Barbara Thompson. Their are nine albums in total (one of which is a
compilation) all realeased on the German "Mood" label which is almost
impossible to find.  I picked all of mine up from "2001", a music shop
in Munich which I believe is part of a chain which have exclusive rights
to the German distribution for Mood.  Most of the UJ+RE albums are
recorded live and feature a number of reworkings of Ian Carr Nucleus
tunes.    The first 6 CD's are available as a package forless than
70DM!  What a great deal!  

All for now



From: Jean-Henry Berevoescu <bjh@netmanage.co.il>
Subject: Gilgamesh
Date: Tue, 8 Dec 1998 17:06:05 +0200 (IST)

[David Voci <david_voci@tcibr.com> wrote:]
> In closing I would like to commend the first Gilgamesh CD as I recently got
> it from a local shop...Hard as hell to get but alas, a great piece...Now to
> be able to find the second one...Which I believe is on Spalax as well as
> the first Soft Heap LP...I have to do some heavy checking as certain Spalax
> stuff is hard to get even though most is pretty well circulated.

Great and hard to find stuff indeed. I managed to find it at the "Forced
Exposure" [a nice on-line shop, it hasn't a "last in technology"
web-page, but the catalog is full of good and hard to find titles and
the service is just fine - it may be a good idea to put it on the
on-line shop list]:


it is a Spalax issue and it costs 16$.

"Play Time" [the 4th piece is one of my top 10 favorites].


PS Our favorite web site has a brand new look. It looks great - and the
adding of the LP covers to the Canterbury discography is a great plus. My
sincere congratulations Aymeric.


From: Rich Williams <punkjazz@snet.net>
Subject: Voiceprint re-issues
Date: Wed, 09 Dec 1998 13:21:08 -0500

[William Storage" <storage@nerve-net.com> wrote:]
>Regarding the Voiceprint releases: [...]
>An interesting thought experiment (not a real offer):
>I find a good copy of the lp. I make a quality CD from it. I make the
>following offer. Send me a Voiceprint copy of Kew Rhone. I will return
>you a copy of the lp-based CD, and your Voiceprint copy with a hole in it
>that renders it useless. This practice ensures that such copying does not
>increase the number of copies in existence (that could be sold). Every
>owner of the lp-based copy payed their dues to Voiceprint and to Greaves.
>There is no possibility of lost sales. "Fair use" ruling is satisfied (you
>can make copies of stuff you own for personal use).

The newest revision of the copyright laws would certainly seem to make this kind of thing illegal, although I must agree that the mastering job is pretty awful. Perhaps you haven't checked out the multimedia files on the CD yet? , IMHO  they are more than worth the price of admission, grit and all.



* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
*               FORTHCOMING CANTERBURY-RELATED CONCERTS                 *
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

[for more info : check out the 'Concerts' page of CALYX - see URL below]

Dec 10 - Dublin, Vicar Street

Dec 15-17 - Paris (France), Satellit'Café [D.Malherbe solo]
Jan 22 - Elancourt (France), venue unknown [tel:]
Jan 23 - Montereau (France), venue unknown [tel:]
Feb 26 - Valenciennes (France), Théatre le Phoenix [tel:]
Feb 27 - Faches-Tumesnil [near Lille] (France), Les Arcades [tel:]
Mar 06 - Jarny (France), Espace Gérard Philippe [tel:]

Dec 18 - Chagford (Devon), Jubilee Hall

Dec 12 - Totnes (Devon), Seven Stars Hotel

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

                            END OF ISSUE 113


WHAT'S RATTLIN' ?     -     WHAT'S RATTLIN' ?     -     WHAT'S RATTLIN' ?

CALYX - The Canterbury Website


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